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DARKSIDER In the world of automotive hobbyists a Darksider is one who modifies and or customizes any and all sorts of vehicles. The Darksiders are in a class of their own simply because they endeavor to be different and do things that others would not attempt for a number of reasons mostly being related to a lack of ability and fear of non conformity.

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Darksider's Realm

A message board & forum for automotive builders, fabricators and customizers who think outside the box.


    my 51 truck

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    jayboy3

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    Re: my 51 truck

    Post  jayboy3 on Thu Jun 25, 2009 6:59 pm

    Yea man, that is awesome on the bed, where do you live I should just let you fix mine, haha! So what about wheelbase, is that going to cause a problem? I believe that the F1 measures 114 from center wheel to center wheel, mine is 119. So would I make the bed the same length as orgianl or have to make it larger to look right. Could it be i am thinking to far ahead, or is that going to be problem? But I can see what you guys are saying that it can work, I just was lead to belive by others there was no way. I will get some pics sat and post them.
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    Re: my 51 truck

    Post  Guest on Thu Jun 25, 2009 7:41 pm

    jayboy3 wrote:I just was lead to believe by others there was no way. .

    You gotta remember, You're on the DARKSIDE now!
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    Darkside Dave
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    Re: my 51 truck

    Post  Darkside Dave on Thu Jun 25, 2009 9:24 pm

    jayboy3 wrote:Yea man, that is awesome on the bed, where do you live I should just let you fix mine, haha! So what about wheelbase, is that going to cause a problem? I believe that the F1 measures 114 from center wheel to center wheel, mine is 119. So would I make the bed the same length as orgianl or have to make it larger to look right. Could it be i am thinking to far ahead, or is that going to be problem? But I can see what you guys are saying that it can work, I just was lead to belive by others there was no way. I will get some pics sat and post them.

    Like the man said, you are on the Dark Side now... We can make anything work...

    Yes, you definitely could be thinking to far in one respect. It's a good idea to have a plan in general but you will drive yourself crazy trying to work out every little detail before you ever start. Just start with an over all general plan and make changes and as you go. I don't think anything I ever built came out like my original idea at the start. In most cases it was an improvement over what I started with.

    Later Man...


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    havi

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    Re: my 51 truck

    Post  havi on Thu Jun 25, 2009 9:43 pm

    How does an engineer keep working? He keeps engineering what he engineered. Always looking for improvements from the original plan.

    If 114" is what you want, you may get away with cutting out the rear section behind the cab. Add some box tube for a regular frame of sorts and it would be kinda like a reverse front suspension graft, lol
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    mostly52f1

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    Re: my 51 truck

    Post  mostly52f1 on Thu Jun 25, 2009 9:52 pm

    i'm thinking you should keep that frame jay... and hey like i said when i figured out it was a galaxy frame over on FTE, you have a built in step notch that will ride really good really low Smile... but now over here no one will argue with you and tell you your screwing up the truck lol.
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    Darkside Dave
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    Re: my 51 truck

    Post  Darkside Dave on Thu Jun 25, 2009 11:15 pm

    OK, it seems like you just need a little suggestion here and there. So I guess it's up to you to decide what is best based on what you have, what's available and how much you ar willing to tackle.

    This is just me talking but I don't like the present frame. I would go for a late '90s Ranger rolling chassis and work from there. Remember, this is just one guy's opinion.

    Later Man...


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    jayboy3

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    Re: my 51 truck

    Post  jayboy3 on Fri Jun 26, 2009 12:07 am

    I knew mostly52 liked that frame from the getgo over on fte. He would be helpful in telling me stuff to try and then they would shoot it down. One in particular I can't recall who it was would just chime in with short post and basically say your stupid if you try it. I am going to quit going in circles with yall about this, cause like dave said, its basically up to me now, just make a choice and go with it. I sure wish I had run into yall before I drove 10hrs last saturday to get that frame. My pride is making me want to use the f1 frame since i vested so much time and effort to get it. My lack of knowlegde also makes me want to use the f1 frame also because I know you can just order most everything you need, if I want to spend the cash. But, something else, maybe the fact that this forum is in black, and its called the darkside, and it feels like we are doing something in secret, makes me want to roam the salvage yards and find that rolling chasie, and make me an F1 out of it. Then drive it around town and tell people "yea, I put that truck together, and you will never guess how I did it and what is on". (okay, I don't know how many off yall know each other, and I know you don't know me really, but that was sort of funny sarcasem because if I managed to get it on another frame it would take specific direction from people like yall)

    anyway no one ever said....am i looking for long wheelbase, short wheelbase, and more on what year is best. that is ranger s10 or dakota
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    charger

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    Re: my 51 truck

    Post  charger on Fri Jun 26, 2009 9:04 am

    going back to your galaxie frame,wheelbase dosen`t matter, get yourself 2 back fenders and center them in the rear wheels (propped up)so you can see what it will look like once done,the back frame can be cut somewhat and even if the rear wheels from the cab are a bit further you just make your box that mutch longer (make it unique!!) you can cut the frame in back of the cab and bring it in more but thats a bit tricky,wish i`d be closer i`d shoot down there and we`d have it figured out pretty quickly!
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    charger

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    Re: my 51 truck

    Post  charger on Fri Jun 26, 2009 11:38 am


    here`s a rough sketch i put together as you can see the pic of the cab frame and box,the box itself would cover up your frame,make a cross brace in the front and back and attach it to the frame,the rear box beam can be mounted on top or bottom of the frame at the back and the floor you make it the height you need to to cover the rear frame hump (same as a s10)your frame is quite wide just exiting the cab so you will have to make yourself a cover sort of the same in my drawing to cover it up,(between cab and fender)blend it into your running board and it will look sweet!
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    jayboy3

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    Re: my 51 truck

    Post  jayboy3 on Fri Jun 26, 2009 12:43 pm

    Ok, I see where we are goin now. So a question about the bed. What do buy do make it out of? Like is there a certain guage or something? Also, after you get that bend on the top, is that just tubing welded on to it? And the stake pockets, are they fabricated or do you just buy that somewhere.

    Now that I see this I think it can be done with out cutting the frame up, I have a friend that builds goose neck trailers and I have no doubt he could weld that up and would love doing it. He likes making stuff like that. What do you do, get the bed sides and front precut or do you cut them yourselves, cause I would think it would be something out or my league to cut that.
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    charger

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    Re: my 51 truck

    Post  charger on Fri Jun 26, 2009 2:59 pm

    all it is is 16 guage steel bent in an angle at the top,then you weld a pipe on top of the angle to give it the roll look, as for the stake pockets all i used is square tubing, i`ll post all the dimensions on monday when i get back from the weekend,the steel sides and front i got pre cut where i bought my steel,the rest was done with a chop saw and grinder with a cut off disc.
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    mostly52f1

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    Re: my 51 truck

    Post  mostly52f1 on Fri Jun 26, 2009 7:43 pm

    i didnt go with the round pipe on the bed sides, i used square. just to give you an idea. be creative Smile
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    havi

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    Re: my 51 truck

    Post  havi on Fri Jun 26, 2009 8:51 pm

    Any Ford Ranger between 1983-1997 with a 7 foot bed had a 114 (actually 113.9) inch wheelbase. I've seen an F1 placed on one of these frames (4x4) and at first glance you can't even tell. I say this, because 1: you were looking for options, and 2: It appears you went and got an F1 frame, and still have the Galaxie (?)frame, whether grafted halves or not, and are still looking for other options. Smile
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    jayboy3

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    Re: my 51 truck

    Post  jayboy3 on Fri Jun 26, 2009 11:39 pm

    Ha, options, that is the word of the day Question affraid Well up untill the invite over here my plan was to take the leaf springs off of the f1 frame I got and put the mustang 2 kit on the front and a four link on the back. I checked the prices and thought it was high and fished for some other options and here I am. I am laughing at myself as I type this. I have trouble taking Daves advice with not thinking too far ahead(although I do belive it is good advice) I think well, yea, I could make the galaxy work, and then I think about every little stinking detail that I don't even know if it matter..for instance, if I make a bed, and adjust the fenders to look right over the wheels, then is running boards going to fit, or will they have to be modified also, and, if I have to make the bed a little longer, am I going to have to find some special plates to fasten the wood floor down. Also, is the front end having drum brakes and issue, or is it no big deal....Yall bound to hate me!!!!
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    charger

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    Re: my 51 truck

    Post  charger on Sat Jun 27, 2009 9:45 am

    i wouldn`t wory about running boards!,its just a piece of steel with 2 angles bent,they can be the length you want, build them yourself its cheaper anyway! think of it this way your truck is a blank canvass,start looking at the net and collect pictures of truck like yours and then see where it can be improved,look at mostly52,he`s got a unique box that im sure knowbody will have if you go to a car show with that truck,it looks awesome!he can take pride he built it himself and i`m sure saved himself piles of money!for the wood slats you can build your own also,very simple to do!i`1l help you via this forum as mutch as i can,i love this kind of stuff!!you`ll just have to decide yourself which frame you want to use,what level you want your truck to be (daily driver,show stomper)and one more thing what is the wheelbase of this truck (center of front spindle to center of rear wheel)
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    mostly52f1

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    Re: my 51 truck

    Post  mostly52f1 on Sat Jun 27, 2009 7:07 pm

    thanks for the complement!
    about the bed floor... i used a big sheet of 14 gage aluminum and bolted aluminum strips down where the factory ones go. it was suppose to be temporary but i have got so many complements on it i think i'm gonna just keep it, but redo the strips with something a little nicer looking.

    i have never seen a bed like mine, but feel free to copy anything, or improve on anything i've done.
    i'm getting ready to cut out the tailgate and redo it. the licence plate is frenched in the center horizontal right now, i'm going to move my taillights to the rear fenders(i seen a mercury panel with some kick ass taillights i'm gonna try and find) then french the licence plate crooked on the left side.

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    jayboy3

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    Re: my 51 truck

    Post  jayboy3 on Wed Jul 08, 2009 11:27 pm

    hey guys, been on vacation....to answer charger the length is 119 from spindle to center of the rear wheels.

    Just another quick thought, if I use this frame, can the drum brakes be converted to disc? I am guessing they are standard galaxy drum brakes. Just a thought. Allright see ya!
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    Darkside Dave
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    Re: my 51 truck

    Post  Darkside Dave on Thu Jul 09, 2009 9:45 am

    jayboy3 wrote:hey guys, been on vacation....to answer charger the length is 119 from spindle to center of the rear wheels.

    Just another quick thought, if I use this frame, can the drum brakes be converted to disc? I am guessing they are standard galaxy drum brakes. Just a thought. Allright see ya!

    If I remember correctly from the pics that was a pre '65 frame with the rear leaf springs. I don't think there were any Ford disc brake options prior to that so it would have to be something after market. If you are refering to the stock truck frame you bought, I think you can get disc brakes for the old straight front axel and I know they are available for the IFS kits. Which frame and suspension are you refering to?

    Later Man...


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    charger

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    Re: my 51 truck

    Post  charger on Thu Jul 09, 2009 12:15 pm

    here`s a link to the frame dimensions http://www.fordbarn.com/earlyv8/forum03/membersarticles/truck/F-1%20Info.pdf your only 5 inches longer wheelbase so it wouldn`t be that bad of a fit!brakes well i`ll have to look around for that one,possibly granada rotors??
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    charger

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    Re: my 51 truck

    Post  charger on Thu Jul 09, 2009 12:22 pm

    here` a bit of info you will need out of ford muscle site:

    Galaxie Disc Brake Swap- from Feb.2001 Car Craft-Ask Marlan
    This swap should work with 60-66 Galaxies according to Phil DeSanto of Ford Galaxie Club of America who sent the information to Marlan.
    Fullsize and Intermediate cars(70’s) all share same spindle assemblies-PN D4AZ-3105-A(right) and 3106-A(left). They bolt onto early Galaxie upper and lower control arms. However, some of the old Galaxie tie rod studs are slightly shorter than the newer disc brake cars- so you must spot face the tie rod stud’s nut seating area on the steering arm by 1/8 inch. The SPINDLES come on: 74-76 full size Ford and Merc., 74-76 Montego and Torino, 74-76 Meteor, 74-79 Lincoln Continental, Mark IV, and Mark V, 74-79 Cougar and Thunderbird, and 77-79 LTDII. The ROTORS come in two sizes and bolt patterns. The fullsize cars have larger rotors(11.8 inches) and use the larger 5-on-5.5 inch bolt pattern. The intermediate cars use a slightly smaller disc(10.720 “) and the early Galaxie bolt pattern of 5-on-4.5”. The intermediates are approximately the same weight class as the early Galaxies( 3600-4100 pounds) All models use the same PADS and CALIPERS (3-3/32 inch bore). The master cylinder (dual) from an 81-87 Ford Crown Victoria seems to work for non power brakes even though the Crown Vic was power assisted. Even the push rod is the correct length for the 63 Galaxie on which DeSanto installed it. An adjustable proportioning valve(aftermarket) is also required.

    sounds like you need to go to the salvage yard now!!!fun !fun!fun!
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    Darkside Dave
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    Re: my 51 truck

    Post  Darkside Dave on Thu Jul 09, 2009 1:34 pm

    Ahhh... Charger seems to have the goods.

    I'd say follow his recommendations.


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    jayboy3

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    Re: my 51 truck

    Post  jayboy3 on Thu Jul 16, 2009 8:49 am

    Allright charger, thats the info I was looking for. I do wish you were close by I would wear out a welcome at your place with questions....Anyway see what you think about this. I maybe can get ahold of a F3 bed and fenders in fair to good condition for a good price. (less than what you said I could build one myself for). So I seen where the f3 wheel base was 123 I think...so thats closer to 119 than the 114 wheel base of a f1. What do you think it would look like. I know its not much closer but I thought it would give more room to adjust the fenders over the wheels.

    And the deal with running boards, I belive someone said earlier in this disscusion that they could easily be made. Yall can look at those pics of where the galaxy frame comes out from under the cab and see how wide it is. I wondered how difficult that would be or if it might look odd as well. I ask all this because If the f3 bed would work on what I got, and I can change over to some disc brakes my project could go alot faster and cheaper. Just wanted somemore thoughts from yall.
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    charger

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    Re: my 51 truck

    Post  charger on Thu Jul 16, 2009 3:25 pm

    as stated before you`ll have build a hump between the cab and bed to hide your frame like a 51 chevy has,heres a picture of what i`m talking about
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    charger

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    Re: my 51 truck

    Post  charger on Thu Jul 16, 2009 3:47 pm

    you gotta remember $600.00 was canadian,its gotta be cheaper in the states?? don`t think it would look bad at all,you`d have to move the fenders and patch up the old holes
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    jayboy3

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    Re: my 51 truck

    Post  jayboy3 on Thu Jul 16, 2009 3:51 pm

    Yea, that looks good, thanks man, your a wealth of info I really do appreciate the guidence. I am just to plan oriented on this thing. I am going to work on it though and let it come together.

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